George lawson ward

[rjshave]

I would really appreciate it if someone would be able to look up a 1901 census for george lawson ward born 1869 in holborn, London and if his wife and children are there. George married Louisa howes in 1890 in Somers town, London and they had George lawson ward 1891, martin wendel ward 1893, Ethel ward 1896, louisa ward 1896 all in the same area. All help would be gratefully recieved.:)

[barbarajoh]

Is this them?

14 Ely Terrace, Mile End Old Town, London
Piece 33 Folio 61 Page 44

George Ward 41 Carpenter born Wandsworth, London
Louisa 37 wife born Yarmouth, Norfolk
Louisa 8 daughter born sommerstown
George 10 son born sommerstown

Other children not with them, I will try and find them too.

Barbara

[barbarajoh]

The only Martin I can find is son to Harry and Ellen Ward living at St Pancreas. He was born in 1893 St Pancreas.

Barbara

[rjshave]

Thanks for what you have found out so far, it is a possiblity that it is them but george wasn't a carpenter and louisa( the child) is ab bit too old to be her. Looking back through what I have so far there is marriage in 1902 in Yarmouth for George Lawson Ward, this would have to be the one married to Louisa, so maybe George is not living with them and they had seperated? :confused:
Thanks again for your help:)

[barbarajoh]

What was George's work then? It seems a bit too close not to be them and I could find no other Martin. Do you have any of them in 1911. Give me more info and I will take another look. Ages in census can often be misleading. If George married in 1902 his first wife must have died. Do we know who he married in 1902.

regards
Barbara

[josie7644]

What was George's work then? It seems a bit too close not to be them and I could find no other Martin. Do you have any of them in 1911. Give me more info and I will take another look. Ages in census can often be misleading. If George married in 1902 his first wife must have died. Do we know who he married in 1902.

regards
Barbara

Hello Barbara,

Here is some background info, which I think is correct, but Rachael will be able to confirm or deny it!

Marriage date: 6 Dec 1890
Church: Somers Town Christ Church
Groom: George Ward aged 23, bachelor, occupation – horsekeeper
Groom’s father: Henry Ward (deceased)
Bride: Louisa Howes aged 23, spinster
Bride’s father: Henry Howes (deceased)
Address for both: 19 Phoenix Street

1891 Census

Address: 72 Clarendon Street
Civil Parish: St Pancras
George Ward age 23, occupation Ostler, born London, St Giles
Louisa Ward age 26, born London Vauxhall

On Freebmd, there is no death of Louisa of the correct age between 1901 and 1902.

The 1902 marriage of George Lawson Ward took place in Yarmouth. The possible spouses are Jessie Emily Beale and Emily Ann Harman.

Had a look in 1911, but I am unable to pinpoint any definites, which correspond with the 1902 marriage!

Josie

[josie7644]

Hello again!

I've just found a fifth child, baptised at Somers Town, St Mary the Virgin.

Her name was Alice Minnie and her baptismal date was 13 Jun 1897 (born 12 April).

The address was 23 Wellesley Street and her father's occupation was Ostler.

Louisa Ward, although baptised on 16 Jan 1896, was born on 23 Sept 1894. Her sister Ethel, baptised at the same time, was born 10th Dec 1895. The address in 1896 was 52 Oldenham/Aldenham Street and George's occupation was horse keeper.

May be the family surname has been mistranscribed in 1901?

Josie

[barbarajoh]

I am really struggling to find them in any census. I have George L senior as a boy in 1871 but can't find him for def in 1881, perhaps you have that? But I have tried every trick I know to find him in 1901 and just can't find any of them. I am toying with the idea that Louisa died between 1897 and 1901 and perhaps George had to leave the children with relatives but they are still not showing under any surname. I see another marriage for a George L Ward to Martha Smith in Yarmouth in 1913. I am not giving up as yet though! Do we know which of these children survived to adulthood? Where are you finding your baptisms?

Barbara

[josie7644]

I am really struggling to find them in any census. I have George L senior as a boy in 1871 but can't find him for def in 1881, perhaps you have that? But I have tried every trick I know to find him in 1901 and just can't find any of them. I am toying with the idea that Louisa died between 1897 and 1901 and perhaps George had to leave the children with relatives but they are still not showing under any surname. I see another marriage for a George L Ward to Martha Smith in Yarmouth in 1913. I am not giving up as yet though! Do we know which of these children survived to adulthood? Where are you finding your baptisms?

Barbara

Hello Barbara,

I'm struggling too! eek) I had the same thought about Louisa's death being prior to 1901, and that the family was split up in 1901.

All five baptisms check out on A*y! Every one has father George Lawson Ward, horse keeper or ostler and mother Louisa.

Josie

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara and Josie,
Alice Minnie, George and Louisa's 5th child died soon after her baptism. In 1911 Martin Wendel is at sea, in the navy. George Lawson junior immigrated to Australia, not sure of a date yet, but he enlisted in the australian army on the 24th June 1915, so he may not be in england in 1911. His next of kin is listed as his mother - louisa ward, so she did not die before 1915. There is an address possibly barnard road, ? house, london but it has been crossed out for his wifes addresses in australia.
I have the same census details for 1891. And I have possible location for him in 1881 as an inmate at middlesex county industrial school?
Regards
Rachel

[rjshave]

I think the address for louisa in 1915 is 60 Burrard road, custom house, london. I believe this is in the newham area of london.

[barbarajoh]

Hi Rachel,

I did see that one at the Industrial school and thought it was possible but we cant' say for sure?

The Martin W in 1911 at sea, I thought was possible til I looked at it and he was born in Portsmouth. There was a Martin born Portsmouth in the 1901 but with totally different parents. Have a look and see what I mean. This Martin is not on the 1911 so I thought he was the same one at sea born Portsmouth So if he is yours there is something funny going on.

I also don't quite understand how a George Lawson Ward was marrying in Yarmouth in 1902. Who was he then, the son. But if Louisa was still living that puts my ideas of kids being farmed out to various places a load of rubbish.


Your family are def hiding!:D I hate being beat. I will keep trying.

Barbara

[barbarajoh]

At least it explains why we can't find Louisa in the death records! That was worrying me somewhat!

Barbara

[barbarajoh]

I searched that address in 1911 but unfortunately Louisa is not there!

Barbara

[rjshave]

Thanks Barbara, nothing is ever that simple with my ward family tree! I thought he and his family would be easy to research, how wrong was! I am not giving up on finding them either:(

[barbarajoh]

There has to be something we are missing. Do you have Martin's navy notes, if it is him or they not easily found? Did you look at the 1901 for this Martin born in portsmouth?

If Louisa didn't die why are they not in the 1901 and 1911 census, I don't understand it at all. I have tried all the christian names with no surname but around the right age and I have tried using Wood, Ware for the usual mistakes. I have even looked in Ireland and Scotland! But they should just be in London. It would prob help if my knowledge of London was better, I have no idea of areas down there. Any more children?

I think because we cant' find any of them that they have to be all together somewhere under a different name but even going on that idea I am not finding them.

I think you need to get hold of electoral rolls to see who is living with Louisa in that house where you know she is in 1916! We are down to needing any clues we can get.

Regards
Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara,
I see you what you mean about Martin. I have not been able to find his navy records either yet, however I am yet to try Australian records.
How would I go about finding electoral rolls for them all?
Kind Regards
Rachel

[barbarajoh]

I don't pretend to be an expert tho I am learning every day! As far as I am aware old ones are held locally. A search found this

http://217.154.230.218/NR/rdonlyres/37CAD668-217E-46C2-B877-DFA02B3C7D9D/0/infono21.pdf

But perhaps you could ask for a look up on one of the genealogy sites if you can't go easily. But it may give who is living in the house at that time. You won't find Louisa unless she lived until 1928 when I think all women got the vote so it will not be as useful as I first thought but could still be worth doing, somebody might be living with her which will help you. She may be living with one of her daughters and her husband which may just help you a bit. I think you are at the stage of trying tiny little straws!!

Have you found a death for Louisa yet? And also do we know when George senr died. I just read the army report for George jnr and am extremely jealous of you having such a colourful ancestor!

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara,
Thanks the link. I shall try and investigate into it.
I think George Lawson Ward senior died in 1940 in New south Wales. There are a couple of entries on the electoral rolls for George Lawson Ward and they go as far forward as 1980.
So far I have not been able to locate Louisa's death, there is quite a few to look through!
Regards
Rachel

[rjshave]

Hi again,
It was George Lawson Ward junior that died in 1940 in new south wales. I have just checked it out and it says he was 49 years old and he died in redfren, new south wales. so I reckon George had a son also called George Lawson ward!!!

[barbarajoh]

Hi Rachel

That sounds very likely, was this son to Beatrice?

I wonder if it would be worth getting the marriage certificate from Norfolk?? Just that this George also disappears, or is very hard to find? Don't 'want to tell you to spend moneyeek) but i would be very curious as to who he is.

I have found on the 1911 a George Ward born 1863 living in the Rowton lodging house but says he is married and a saddler born in London Kentish Town. Not quite right but better than we have had.

RG14 Piece 683 enumeration 34 St Pancreas. Arlington Road, Camden Town.

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara,
George Lawson wards (junior) child - George lawson ward ( junior, junior) was born 6th February 1926, so I don't think it was Beatrix, seeing as she had remarried by then!
George LAwson Ward (junior,junior) married Rose Gwendoline Swanston in Granville, New south Wales in 1946.
I want to order the marriage certificate for George in Yarmouth, but can I order it when I don't have the brides surname?
Rachel

[barbarajoh]

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/

This is the site I use for ordering certificates and yes you can order using his name and the GRO number of the certificate plus year and quarter. I can't remember what they are but the prices are okay on this site compared to a few others! Let me know when it comes.

Regards
Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi barbara,
Just ordered the marriage certificate in 1902! Should be here by next Thursday.
Regards
Rachel

[rjshave]

I am really sorry to put a spanner in the works but I looked on a certain website and there is a child called ernest ward baptised 21st April 1885. His mother is Bessie and his father is George Lawson ward!!! :confused:

[barbarajoh]

you have heard of one name studies, well we are doing a 3name study!!

Still want to know who they are and that one doesn't show up in the census either, does he?

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara!
Very confusing indeed! Hope this marriage certificate in 1902 will answer some questions! Apparently this Ernest Ward was christened in doncaster, york!

Rachel

[barbarajoh]

Hi Rachel
The plot thickens!

We will wait and see. Who knows what it will bring up. Have you looked for Ernest in the census?

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi barbara,
I don't think this Ernest ward is George lawson wards son as I have found an Ernest ward in 1891 aged 5 living with Bessie in doncaster. There is also an 8 year old called George g ward and Bessie's husband is called George g ward!-not George l ward! What do your think?
Rachel

[rjshave]

hi,
I have just recieved the marriage certificate for George Lawson ward on the 20th January 1902 in the parish church of great yarmouth.
George Lawson Ward 39 Bachelor fisherman living row 132. Father - henry ward - publican
Emily ann Harman 46 widow living row 132. Father - George Baxter- fisherman
Witnesses - Edward John Lupson and Hannah Andrews
Rachel

[barbarajoh]

That doesn't help a great deal then, can we find this George Lawson, fisherman with his father Henry publican in an earlier census?

We still have the electoral roll to see who is staying at that address. If you put it on one of the london lists someone might help you.

Sorry we are not getting very far!

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara,
My ancestor George Lawson ward's father was Henry Hazzard ward and he was a publican/barman/potman so it is very likely that he is the right George Lawson ward but as you say this gives us more questions and very few answers!!
Rachel

[barbarajoh]

wow, Rachel, I knew his father was Henry but the age is a bit out and he says he is a bachelor but I did wonder. Need our lateral thinking here. Are you thinking he split from Louisa and remarried while she was still alive. And this is why he is hiding on the census. Doesn't tell us where the kids are though. Wonder if he got caught for it - newspapers?

It is still another piece of the jigsaw. So we are getting closer.

Barbara

[barbarajoh]

Rachel,

I have just found a George Hewson Wood, travelling showman in the 1901 census at the Cock Inn, Thetford, Norfolk, His age is wrong 49 but I just wonder as the name is so close. We will just bear him in mind.

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara,
I am thinking that he did remarry whilst louisa was still alive, as my great grandfather, Arthur ward( his brother) appears to have done so with his first wife! Could his children have been put in workhouses?
I found the birth for a George Hewson Wood, born June 1851 in Norwich, so I think we can disregard the census.
Thank you once again for helping me piece this together. I really appreciate it.
Rachel

[barbarajoh]

I know how frustrating it can be. I am sure the answer is out there somewhere. Yes it makes the junior George very likely to be the one in the Industrial school I wonder if Louisa reverted back to her maiden name or did the same.

Will keep looking. And will look for him in the census with his wife under any name.

Barbara

[josie7644]

Hello Rachel and Barbara,

On Find My Past, I clicked on “Life Events” and scrolled down to “Divorce Indexes 1858-1903”.

A search for George Ward produced two results, one in 1898 and the other in 1902.

A similar search for Louisa Ward gave the same two dates.

As I don’t have a subscription to FMP, I am unable to view the details for you, but I think the results could be promising!

Josie :D

[rjshave]

Wow, that does sound promising Josie. I didn't think divorces happened back in those days. If they did divorce, would he have put bachelor on the marriage certificate? Divorce is a very new subject to be!
Thanks both of you for your continued help. The ward family was difinately a complex family!

[davelambert271]

Hi Josie/Rachel, sorry to disappoint, but the results do not have any christian names to them, so the two which come up when you put George or Louisa are the same results, neither of which have anything to do with the family being looked for.

In those days divorce was for the rich. It cost so much the ordinary man in the street couldn't afford it, so they just drifted apart. If they remarried they would lie about being married before, say they were widowed or that they were single.

dave

[josie7644]

Oh that is such a disappointment! Sorry Rachel for giving you false hopes! eek)

Thanks Dave for spotting the error. You got there just in time to stop Rachel wasting her money! :)

Josie

[barbarajoh]

Easy done Josie, I found them too on find my past but have a subscription so quickly understood they were just lists with no first names.

New site today Rachel

http://www.britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk/

I have already had a look using George Lawson Wood as a phrase but might be worth you searching using just George L Wood or George Wood to see if there is anything on him.

You need a break soon!

Barbara

[rjshave]

I was getting excited about the divorce, but it was a long shot Josie, so don't worry :). Thanks Dave for the information on divorces.
Thank you also Barbara for the link, there is a lot to look through!
Yesterday I found a newspaper extract from the australian library about George Lawson Ward - 1891. Unfortunately in 1932 he was at Bathurst court, new south wales, fined £5 or 10 days imprisonment for assulting a patrick O'leary on Bathurst Common. He was also fined a similiar ammount for using bad language. It also went on to say an Evelyn Ward, presumingly his second wife was also charged with bad language!!!!
So at least we know where he was living in 1932 and what his second wife was called!

[barbarajoh]

why am I saying Wood, hope I didn't search for Wood too. Wasn't he an artist of some kind?

will recheck using Ward.

Barbara

[barbarajoh]

He has been a lot easier to find than his father!:D

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi everyone,
I have just found a website and an email address for someone researching the Baxter family tree from Suffolk. George's second wife Emily Ann Harman was formally Emily Ann Baxter, and this website has her first marriage on there, so I have just emailed this person to see if she can shed any light onto the situation! Fingers crossed!!!
Rachel

[barbarajoh]

I really hope so Rachel, keep us posted.

Barbara

[rjshave]

Hi Barbara
That last straw resulted in no new information! I am not giving up but going to wait until after christmas and hope that I can figure this puzzle out!
All the best
Rachel x

[barbarajoh]

Yep, don't give up, a fresh look in the New Year is a good idea.

Merry Xmas

Barbara

[rjshave]

Update on George Lawson Ward -

George Lawson Ward born 6th february 1926 in Burwood, new south wales. Father was George lawson ward ( 1891). Mother - evelyn? It appears that he died january 2007. He had lived at clyde view drive, long beach, batesman bay, new south wales. He was married to a rose gwendoline swanston. Don't know if they had any children. I have written a letter to the last address to see if they know anything!

George lawson ward (1869) who moved to Yarmouth and married emily ann harman in 1902 is still not on a census. However his wife Emily Ward was an inmate at a workhouse in caister road, yarmouth in 1911. And 2 of her children were living at no 24 row 139! If George was a fisherman he could have been at sea on the night! I believe I have found a possible death for this george

Deaths sep 1914
Ward George L 44 Yarmouth 4b21

He may also have remarried to a Martha E smith, but not sure yet!

[barbarajoh]

Hi Rachel

You are making progress then? Good to hear it. Keep us posted, perhaps the death will have a clue of some kind once you have his address.

Doesn't look like he ever got caught for being a bigamist if that is what he was.

Barbara

[crankypants]

Hi Rachel


Sydney Morning Herald New Paper – Death Notice - Tuesday, April 20, 1982
WARD Rose Gwendoline – April 18, 1982, at hospital,
late of 5 Kilpa Road, Wyongah, formerly of Lakemba,
beloved wife of George, loving mother and mother-in-law
of Raymond and Betty, Victor and Maria, and loving
grandmother of Kim and Glen, Scott, Lee and Troy.


1980 N.S.W Electoral Roll – District: Hunter – Subdistrict: Kanwal
WARD George Lawson, 5 Kilpa Rd, Wyngh, dry clnr
WARD Rose Gwendoline, 5 Kilpa Rd, Wymgh, h.d


cheers
cp

[rjshave]

Thank you so much for that last piece of information. It is so exciting!
rachel

[rjshave]

Hi everyone
Update on George Lawson Ward
I have recieved a letter from Australia about the George Lawson who recently died and unfortunately he had no connection to my family tree.
This George Lawson ward was born George Lawson and adopted at the age of 4 by his Auntie Vera Ward. He kept the lawson surname as a middle name!
Also these wards were originally "wenck" and changed there surname during ww1 to the more angilised version of Ward. So there is no way they can be related to me. This George Lawson ward was the one who married rose gwendoline
So all I know now is that George Lawson born 1891 in London, immigrated to australia and died in redfern in 1940 aged 49. He was married to an Evelyn but I dont know if they had any children?
Some answers but more questions!!

[juliejtp]

Hi Rachel,

Inquest date 6 Sept 1940

In Lane of no 63 Cleveland St - Redfern.

George Lawson Ward - age 49 - Place of birth England.



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